Iracing "hosted Races"


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#1 Peter Burke

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 10:14 AM

Is anyone here on iRacing? I signed up with a trial membership last week and am loving it. Not necessarily the fact that I have to drive dog slow underpowered rookie cars, but a) the sim feels like GPL/N2003 on steroids, and B) you can race a decent sized field pretty much any time of day, and people in general are serious about what they are doing - saw only one or two completely incompetent drives in my early sessions, but their ratings system moved me straight up to the better drivers (last night I was racing only "licensed" drivers who have been on the service for a long time, me being the only rookie in the field.

Anyway - the news on iRacing is that you can now run any car and track you like (and can afford) - $3.00 per race buys you a private session you can host with your league/friends and run whatever you want. 4 hours of racing under your own rules and ratings. So if you want to run a Lotus 79 league with a dozen rookies who never were on iRacing before, you now can do that.

Obviously, there is the cost factor that will always drive people to sims like rFactor, but I am starting to realize that "you get what you pay for" with the free sims. Pay-to-play and $$ for tracks and cars at iRacing can make it quite difficult to enter the service, especially if you're used to calling the shots in your group and race with your friends. The anonymous public ranking ladder deal never really attracted me there, and I am still not sure if I will continue to race those events, although it appears to me that in the upper licenses classes people do know each other simply from racing with each other for months, and continually bumping into each other due to similiar rankings.

I have a hunch the iRacing folks have realized they hit critical mass with the number of hard core subscribers who were going to drop $150 a year and buy every track only to race total strangers and compete for something the average subscriber would never reach (top "pro" league championship, international level). The league world where "the rest of us" could have fun didn't have any room on their service, but that is now being addressed (at an extra cost, obviousl, but then the subscription prioces were dropped and you can early credit by actually racing online (again, a sign that things aren't going so well and their attrition of users is pretty high. Why else would they motivate people to participate with dollar bonuses if things were booming?)  

That business side of the service aside, the simulation they offer is SOOO much better than anything I've ever seen that I am definitely hooked and will drop money on cars and tracks for some time to come. I look at it like this - a set of tires for my motorcycle costs  more than a year of service plus a half dozen tracks and cars, and I certainly get more miles and thrill out of the sim than a set of bike tires...). Heck, I spend more on Netflix than this would cost me and I barely watch enough movies to make that worth the cost.

Anyway - backto my reason for asking of anyone here was on iRacing - I'd spring for the cost of each race of a season to organize an AtlasF1 iRacing presence. The www.legends-league.com dudes are already out there testing the league feature... Anyone interested in joining me? cars/tracks up to general consensus (it IS a money thing, if you go beyond basics).

PS - if you want to try it out, I found a promo code on another forum that gave me a free month, the Radical SR8 extra car, and Silverstone extra track (the latter two cost $27 if you need to buy them...)

Quote

http://forum.racesim...ad.php?t=336218

first post - also gets you an extra car and track, $25 value I guess
based on their pricing scheme


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FREE 1 month subscription using the Radical SR8.
Promotion Code: PR-RADICAL-ONE-MONTH

Your membership registration includes the following promotion:
Radical Test Drive - $0
A complimentary one-month subscription to iRacing.com, including basic
content plus the Radical SR8 race car and the Silverstone Circuit race
track. Includes the cars and the tracks used by the Rookie Oval series
and the Rookie Road Racing series.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


new regular prices
http://www.inracingn...s-lower-prices/

#2 Brian McLean

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 04:24 PM

I am curious enough to try it. What would happen if we all take the promotional offer and join a server at the same time? Might we all end up race each other?

I took a look at the registration and it asks for a reference email. Will you get something, like a free month. If so just PM me your email and I will use that.

#3 Arturo Pereira

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 05:17 PM

Hi Peter :)

I was bebatesting iRacing since 2005 till mid 2008 and so I guess I know very well their system. By those times, one of the main requirements from the crowd of betatesters was, besides making GPL2, the absence of league racing in their structure. I am very glad they are implementing this.

Personally, I have run all of their basic cars and, well, I do not like them, so this is the main reason Iīve never subscribed to iRacing since itīs release. This and the fact that it demands time and practice to get a higher rating and, being usually busy with league stuff, racing online and betatesting GPL mods, I do not have the time to commit to other racing stuff. Managing 4 Divisions in AtlasF1, getting enough practice to be competitive and trying beta stuff is time consuming as you know.

However, I am waiting till iRacing releases their complete NASCAR racing and then I was going to propose Oval drivers to give it a try. The rest of their stuff, including the Lotus 79, is not my cup of tea. I will never drive a Lotus 79 except it is painted properly ;)
AP

#4 Peter Burke

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 10:08 PM

have you driven the Radical SR8 (part of the free promo)?  

I mean - that car compared to ANYTHING in rFactor is a kick. Meanwhile, the base cars you may have tested are not the same anymore. even the Ford Spec racer you may have tried was changed last week. The car now is one amazing little scooter. Handles like a Porsche 908, just not with the nice engine note and a little slower, but not much, especially not when running on Lime Rock in a field of 20.

As for us getting on the same server - only if we had similar ratings, other than that it's a random thing. If for example like tonight 45 drivers register for a particular timeslot in the rookie series, you are split onto 3 servers and you will find yourself mostly in a field with drivers of similar safety rating. After just a few days I now rarely have any other rookies in the fields they put me in, so we'd probably not meet up until you update your rating with a few days of safe racing. The league is different - all who have the password can join,

#5 Peter Burke

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 11:18 AM

View PostArturo Pereira, on Oct 28 2009, 06:17 PM, said:

Hi Peter :)
However, I am waiting till iRacing releases their complete NASCAR racing and then I was going to propose Oval drivers to give it a try. The rest of their stuff, including the Lotus 79, is not my cup of tea. I will never drive a Lotus 79 except it is painted properly ;)

I haven't run a single oval event at iRacing, so I don't know what's great about it. The mini oval car they make you drive as a rookie felt like crap, so I parked it after 10 loops around the mini oval and moved on to road racing.

How about the Dallara IRL car coming up any day - mixed oval/road schedule?  Or anything with the Corvette C6.R? The Lotus is probably too much car for a lot of people anyway.  

I could handle your iRacing admin for the league. Don't really want to start up my old IICC again, as most of the guys there have retired for good. It really shouldn't be a lot of work to handle admin duties as everything is done server side (no track versions that could be incorrect, no mod versions, engine hacks, pace car thresholds, etc - all that is iRacing fixed). Doing the scoring should be pretty quick, given the results data you get now in CSV format and the availability of various scoring programs that import these files.  I was thinking of a small 6 race mini season to test the waters, using mostly tracks people already own, so the cost of entry isn't going to kill it before it starts. Geting a custom car like the Vette would already cost extra and keep the rookie riff-raff from signing up.

The  Legends League guys are doing an iRacing league test season, running a specracer on standard tracks with sessions barely longer than the public 25 min sprints - something I don't see the point of. I can race that format every 30 mins with my subscription right now, full fields every time, and with the rating I've earned I generally get to race a field of safe veteran drivers anyway. I see the iRacing league option (they call it "Hosted Racing") as a space to allow for formats that just aren't offered on the public schedule, such as 1+ hour races, and cars and track combos that aren't as popluar as anything with the letters NASCAR on them (which appears to cover 3/4 of the iRacing users). By now there are about 20 NASCAR-based leagues proposed on iRacing, so no worries that there's not going to be a place to run that full Cup schedule one day.

#6 Brian McLean

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 03:40 PM

Ok I signed up and have tested a little bit. Looks interesting so far. Surprised everything starts from your browser. I'll test some more tonight.

#7 Mik Mercier

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 09:30 PM

I took some time off iRacing because of the cost but then they went and lowered the prices so instead of getting RaceOn I decided to get back into iRacing, for 60$ a year (You now get 10$ of participaction money if you participate a minumum every season) it's the best sim out there and no non-sense of having to figure out mods and so on. Of course the content cost something but they've lower their prices on that also.  They have tones of great tracks, Mosport just being released, YAY!!!  And more on the way and the feel and look of the tracks are awesome.

Since I first joined, the changes have made iRacing a million times better and the cars just keep getting better and better plus the covette and indy should be here saturday, I'm guessing for halloween.  And next is the ford GT (GT2 version) and the mustangs right around the corner so a mixed class racing should be fun when it's made possible.  For the moment hosted racing is only one class but they're working on that...

There are tones of nascar and truck leagues but I'm more interested in the Road races.  I'm not crazy about the open wheel cars yet, they have some things to straigten out but they're getting there. The Radical and DP are awesome, the Slowstice and VW are fun to toss around on the smaller layouts. I'm guessing the Vette and Indy should be a blast.

BTW to the guys who beta tested, the cars are not the same at all, they grip much better and that 'ice-like' handling that many complained about is gone, not to mention they've added so many options and changed so much that it's not the same sim.

One thing about iRacing is they do listen to feedback and I know much of what I've asked for is being added bit by bit.  An interesting option comming soon is the ability to schedule your races days in advanced so more people can get together for the same session.  You don't need that for the Solstice but with the DP and Radical it's needed.

Anyways if you guys plan on running road stuff then I'd be up for it.  :thumbup:

Edited by Mik Mercier, 29 October 2009 - 09:39 PM.

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#8 Peter Burke

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 10:37 AM

Dallara Indycar and Corvette C6.R available as of today...


http://www.iracing.c...nd-tracks/cars/

#9 Peter Burke

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 10:45 AM

View PostArturo Pereira, on Oct 28 2009, 06:17 PM, said:

However, I am waiting till iRacing releases their complete NASCAR racing and then I was going to propose Oval drivers to give it a try.

that'll be 2010 - just seen in their pro series forums:

Quote

In 2010, the oval series will be sanctioned in concert with our NASCAR partners, and each week the racing will take place at the same venues as the real world Sprint Cup Series utilizing the NASCAR Sprint Cup cars.

I'd say they'll have to have all the cup tracks available as well, although I doubt I'd spend that much money to race stock cars. Too many tracks.

#10 Arturo Pereira

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 11:37 AM

View PostPeter Burke, on Oct 29 2009, 02:18 PM, said:

I could handle your iRacing admin for the league.


Hi Peter :)

I have absolutely no problem with that. If you need an specific forum or sub-forum here, let me know and we can get it open in a day or 2. The basic rules of AtlasF1 Legends League are posted in the main forum, so if you think they should be changed, let me know and send me the proposals.

Even if I make most of the final decisions here, all drivers are encouraged to give their opinions about schedules, mods, etc.. We use to be very strict on ontrack behaviour but, since I am alone on the league management, my decisions on that respect are final. Sometimes I asked the opinions of some old league members about some incidents, and sometimes they PM their opinions anyway. I take those opinions as quite important for making the right decisions, though I assume 100% of the responsability for them.

So, if you want to start some sort of AtlasF1 Legends League - iRacing Division, give it a go. :)
AP

#11 Peter Burke

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 12:30 PM

View PostArturo Pereira, on Oct 30 2009, 12:37 PM, said:

Hi Peter :)

I have absolutely no problem with that. If you need an specific forum or sub-forum here, let me know and we can get it open in a day or 2. The basic rules of AtlasF1 Legends League are posted in the main forum, so if you think they should be changed, let me know and send me the proposals.

Even if I make most of the final decisions here, all drivers are encouraged to give their opinions about schedules, mods, etc.. We use to be very strict on ontrack behaviour but, since I am alone on the league management, my decisions on that respect are final. Sometimes I asked the opinions of some old league members about some incidents, and sometimes they PM their opinions anyway. I take those opinions as quite important for making the right decisions, though I assume 100% of the responsability for them.

So, if you want to start some sort of AtlasF1 Legends League - iRacing Division, give it a go. :)

sweet - I'll do a little more reading on what is being offered by others, but so far I haven't seen anyone offer a Dallara or C6.R league. Have to grab the cars and do some testing to see what feels like more fun. Based on the registrations for tonight's fun races in either car, they are both very popular (56 entries for C6R in Mosport, 70 for the Dallara at IMS)

I prefer loose regulations - and in the case of iRacing, most items that used to cause huge discussions in other leagues, such as course cutting, are already handled by hte software with no way around it. This akes a lot of "is this legal?" discussion out of the debate and lets you focus on the basics. There wills till be room for folks to misbehave, as the league format is one of the few places where racers on iRacing will enter knowing that whatever they do won't affect their ratings. Long races usually will drive the hotheads to other leagues, so we'll probably end up with a pretty serious group.

My thinking right now is a warmup season with 6 to 8 races, ustilizing as many of the free tracks as possible. I'll grab the new cars later tonight and do some driving to see what we got. I'm sure we'd get interest in either car class, and with the AtlasF1 label, they'll know it'll be quality racing  :thumbup:

#12 Ignacio Genta

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 05:32 PM

Hello Peter.Long time since I raced in IICC...
I will give Iracing a try !!!

#13 Peter Burke

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Posted 31 October 2009 - 02:11 PM

View PostIgnacio Genta, on Oct 30 2009, 06:32 PM, said:

Hello Peter.Long time since I raced in IICC...
I will give Iracing a try !!!

Nice to see you again - it's been a few years :)

I just ran the Corvette and the IRL car for a few hours. I gave the Corvette a lot of time, but even though the car is one brutal beast, the better racing will most likely come from that Dallara. It just is a lot less likely to bite you with a snap overteer or anything else that's just natural for a big block corvette with relatively low downforce. You also see a lot better in an open cockpit car, plus we can race it on ovals and road courses. I'm pretty certain that if I am hosting anything, it'll be the Dallara for the first season.

#14 Mik Mercier

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Posted 31 October 2009 - 03:50 PM

I've also spent some time racing the covette and had some amazing close racing at Mosport, talk about a rollercoaster ride!   :banana: Crazy fun once you get to know the car, it's true you can go for the loose setup and then one wrong move and that's it but I tend to like to run a little more safe and consistant, which is a good thing when the tires start to run out.  The damage is amazing also, if you touch the wall or get some decent contact you will have all kinds of strange things go wrong which is how I think it should be.

I've spent less time with the Dallara, will run it more tonight but it's also an amazing car, would be great to have some road races with it, I'll give the Ovals another try with this car, who knows I might like it...

I've also been enjoying the increased dust and smoke effects, very cool.  :beerchug:
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#15 Peter Burke

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 11:01 AM

I've been doing a lot of laps in both cars, C6.R and Dallara, and even though the Corvette is a LOT of fun, I think for a league, it is the less usable car. It is less forgiving to mistakes than the open wheeler (you just can't catch it when it goes over the edge), it has much less visibility, and since it's not an oval car, we'll probably find less drivers interested in it (you should see how quickly an all oval Dallara league had over 50 people signed up...).  

The only thing that worries me about the Dallara is the complex setup screen. You almost need a real engineer to make sense of all the wicker and winglet options. Somebody will probably do well just because they figure out how to make that thing go faster based on setup alone, but I guess that is part of the appeal of a high tech car. Meanwhile, there's still that driving skill factor - it took me 10 laps at Silverstone to bring my left front tire down to 33% tread remaining, so I guess I need to learn to keep the tires from locking up, otherwise I'll need extra pit stops. Could have been the insane forward brake bias of the default setup, but I see that inside front locking up a lot due o weight transfer. Smoother may be faster in a race.

I'm pretty close to calling this a go - have to check the available track listing again, think through the points system, and decide on exact race distances and some other details such as how to deal with the number of pit stalls versus how many people to sign up. Overbooking may be possible, but who really wants more than 33 cars on a track anyway?

Things I already decided are:

Race on Sunday early evening, green flag around 8pm eastern/ 5pm Pacific - iRacing servers are PACKED at that time.
longer races (e.g. 300 miles at Indy, 1+ hour races everywhere)
yellows on
4 ovals, 5 or 6 road courses - tentative schedule with week 1 being the coming weekend:

week 1 Test      Indy  80 laps
week 2 Oval      Indy  120 laps
week 3 Test       Laguna  40 laps
week 4 Road   Laguna   65 laps
week 5 Oval    Lowe's   200 laps
week 6 Road   Infineon IRL  60 laps
week 7 Road   Silverstone GP 50 laps
week 8 Road   Indy Road  50 laps

week 9 Oval    Homestead  200 laps
week 10 Oval    Michigan  200 laps

week 11 Road   Mosport  60 laps
week 12 Road   Road America  50 laps


This calendar keeps the cost of entry down at the beginning - only IMS costs $14.95 early on (and buys you Indy road course for a later race), then you should be alright until Infineon Dec. 13 before you need to buy another track. By then most people who don't like the car will probably have bailed from the league.

I have to think about license requirements to allow people in, although I see no reason to no allow iRacing rookies in as long as they have a sim racing background. This only matters really if there is more interest than pit stalls anyway.

The points system will probably be split into multiple sub championships based on driver's iRating or license level, plus an overall system.  The IRL has a points system that goes all the way to P33 and it seems somewhat progressive, while it rewards folks for showing up, too, so why not use it?  
Points 50 40 35 32 30 28 26 24 22 20 19 18 17 16 15 14 13 12 12 12 12 12 12 12 10 10 10 10 10 10 10 10 10
and 1 point for pole position, 2 points fo rmost laps led


I'll be hosting for the official race sessions and throw in the occasional practice based on iRacing credits I earn while on the system. Others in the league will be encouraged to do the same, so we get to run together as much as possible. Just setting up your car and running solo hotlaps won't prepare anyone for a wheel to wheel oval race in these cars.

Timeline right now is probably one more day of testing before I announce over at iRacing, so we could use a form here. I'll be refering to the same overall rules posted for all leagues here, and add the iRacing specific details to that forum (so please Arturo - create one for AtlasF1 iRacing)

Peter

Edited by Peter Burke, 02 November 2009 - 11:22 AM.


#16 Arturo Pereira

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 12:00 PM

Sounds like a plan Peter  :beerchug:

I will PM SG admins to get an AtlasF1 - iRacing Division forum, which I expect to be up and running in a day or 2 :)
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#17 Peter Burke

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 12:55 PM

great - I guess I'll be going live as soon as the forum is up and I can put up something semi official  :gpler:

#18 Peter Burke

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 04:05 PM

View PostPeter Burke, on Nov 2 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

great - I guess I'll be going live as soon as the forum is up and I can put up something semi official  :gpler:

for those with an iracing account, here's the announcement thread on their forum:

http://members.iraci...j...73&tstart=0

#19 Mik Mercier

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 06:48 PM

Sounds cool guys,  I did some Indy races and to my surprise had a lot of fun racing the oval, :trink4:  well at the races that I was able to run clean that is... I ran some races where a lot of the guys were wearing their helmets too tight!  :bash: Well it's all part of week13, gotta take the good with the bad... B)

I agree on the setup aspect and I'm guessing the good setups will be prized and loved but I'm hoping iRacing will send us some for every track, I know I'm not the only asking for that service, maybe they will hear us...

Edited by Mik Mercier, 02 November 2009 - 06:48 PM.

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#20 Peter Burke

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Posted 02 November 2009 - 07:06 PM

View PostMik Mercier, on Nov 2 2009, 06:48 PM, said:

Sounds cool guys,  I did some Indy races and to my surprise had a lot of fun racing the oval, :trink4:  well at the races that I was able to run clean that is... I ran some races where a lot of the guys were wearing their helmets too tight!  :bash: Well it's all part of week13, gotta take the good with the bad... B)

I agree on the setup aspect and I'm guessing the good setups will be prized and loved but I'm hoping iRacing will send us some for every track, I know I'm not the only asking for that service, maybe they will hear us...

I'm pretty sure road course setups will be very similar across all tracks, but the ovals are going to be the ones that make the difference. The good news is that I am already collecting those setups I find posted and shared and will pass those along to everyone who wants them.

What I am not so sure about is if there will be some sort of crazy exploit like in the rFactor CART mod where you can run the vehicle scraping on the belly pan with sparks flying around the entire lap and get better downforce than those guys who listen to the instructions and keep the aero tunnel at the recommended ride height.

anway, it is set in motion, now we need to see if enough people want to race these cars more seriously than in a 20 lap sprint




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