76 replies to this topic

[Jim Carvalho]

You're a GEM+ Donnie. Thanks for all you do. You should post these at SRMZ, or at least a link to this thread.

[Donnie Yourth]

Hi, JC!  

I'll give that suggestion some consideration, mate.

South of the border...  Down Mexico way...

https://www.youtube....h?v=kzogTxwnDjQ

Yes sir, we're headed to the challenging Autódromo de la Ciudad de México this week.  Sweepers, long straights, hairpins.  You name it...  It's got it.

Stepping into Mr. Peabody's WABAC Machine, I'll transport you back to December, 2009 where in post #19 of 'Grids by Doni', you'll find revised layouts for this venue.  Just to confirm, I downloaded them this morning and checked them over.  They're good to go!  

http://forums.speedg...13

[Donnie Yourth]

About 20 miles(30km)south of Paris, you will still find the stunning and, frankly, imo, bizarre track of Linas Montlhery.  For some data on this circuit...

https://en.wikipedia...as-Montlhéry

Sadly, it's been no stranger to many tragedies...

http://www.motorspor...8,1387,181,1331

For our upcoming races, the zip below provides revised grid spacing with fully a 10m spacing in a 2x2 staggered pattern.  Starter on the right.  Standard pit board location.  Tests today showed all looked well.

 2016-10-23 mnty66 grids.zip   11.27K   2 downloads

Good Luck!  You'll need it!  

[Donnie Yourth]

This should have things covered for our upcoming rounds at Laguna Seca...

 2016 adc laguna67 revised grids.zip   11.88K   5 downloads

[Donnie Yourth]

And as for Monza 10k...

 2016 adc monza 10k revised grids.zip   14.23K   5 downloads

[Donnie Yourth]

Putting the wrap on the full slate of circuits for November, 2016, gys.  Zips for...

 2016 adc clermont grids.zip   13.61K   2 downloads

 2016 adc kyalami grids.zip   27.69K   2 downloads

 2016 adc oulton2 grids.zip   12.66K   2 downloads

 2016 adc brands67 grids.zip   11.34K   3 downloads

I've left the Clermont grid arrangement at a 2x2 parallel affair as trying to give each car a 10m deep spacing puts the last rows right round the last corner.  Hardly ideal.  Just mind your start with the knowledge that someone is starting equal with you.

Brands required some considerable rework.  The original grid is a 3x2 parallel layout and the outside starters of the row with three cars placed them perilously close to the grass verge left & right.  Additionally, the pole man couldn't see the starter from the cockpit!  LOL!  I've set the new grid at 2x2 with a 10m deep spacing and pulled the right-side starter closer to the track C/L.  Ditto for the left-side starter.  Much less chance of slipping sideways off the line and ending up in the grass.  Pole man can now see the starter at far left from the cockpit.

Have fun!  

[Donnie Yourth]

As mentioned in the race thread, I wasn't all that thrilled with the alignment of the grids posted above.  Good depth spacing but perhaps too tight laterally.  This placement allowed for a clean shot up between the two cars starting directly ahead but could cause as much grief as it avoids.  Accordingly, here is a full set of revised Laguna67 grids with all left side cars in direct alignment 20m apart.  Ditto for the right side.  Save the originals if preferred.

 2016 adc laguna67 revised grids REV1.zip   9.92K   2 downloads

Get 'em while their hot!  

[Donnie Yourth]

HO-HO-HO!  

Yes, it's prezzie time as Christmas is just over the horizon.  I've checked my records and all you little boys & girls have been very good.  Well, mostly...  

Grids for the month of December, 2016 are...

 watgCA71 grids.zip   13.57K   7 downloads

 monza grids.zip   11.46K   3 downloads

 snett67 grids.zip   11.81K   4 downloads

 albi grids.zip   10.61K   3 downloads

The grid for the BR at the Targa Florio is fine 'as is'.  Errr...  Unless you want to take a chance and try my 'special'.    Each starter is set back fully 1000m from the one ahead for a clear road ahead and simulates the time delay release of the cars as they started back in the day in real-life.  It works just fine as the attached replay shows but special considerations for using it must be in place and known to all runners.  That last is probably not going to happen, is it?  The object of the experiment is to race back to where you started from rather than get to the S/F line to complete a full timed lap.  Elapsed time back to your starting point determines the finishing order.  Probably asking way, way too much to be tried.  Still, it was fun to arrange...

 targa exp start.zip   5.67MB   3 downloads

[Bob Simpson]

Donnie Yourth, on 05 December 2016 - 02:32 PM, said:

The grid for the BR at the Targa Florio is fine 'as is'.  Errr...  Unless you want to take a chance and try my 'special'.    Each starter is set back fully 1000m from the one ahead for a clear road ahead and simulates the time delay release of the cars as they started back in the day in real-life. It works just fine as the attached replay shows but special considerations for using it must be in place and known to all runners.  That last is probably not going to happen, is it?  The object of the experiment is to race back to where you started from rather than get to the S/F line to complete a full timed lap.  Elapsed time back to your starting point determines the finishing order.  Probably asking way, way too much to be tried.  Still, it was fun to arrange...

I don't understand this.  You're suggesting that each driver's time will stop when they pass their starting grid position?  How can that be without modifying the track?  And certainly you can't have it different for each driver in the same race.

If that's so, I don't see the point.  Why not just let the time start and stop at the start/finish line?  The last driver will just have to trundle on for some minutes before the time gets started.

And finally, how would the drivers set way back know when the flag was dropped?

I do like the idea of the spread out grid, as long as there is someone at the front texting when the flag drops (assuming that everyone has "In-car chat" enabled and that they don't use the no-letterbox bars patch) and also just letting the time be registered at the start/finish line.  You can alternatively judge the flag drop as the count-down as you join the grid plus 15 seconds.  Just don't cut it too close as there's no point.

[Donnie Yourth]

Hi, Bob.  There are work-arounds for each point you raise.  Trust me, in some other leagues, this kind of thing was not unknown.  I would not have bothered to post if it weren't doable but the sticking point is that everyone must know the procedure in advance and adhere to it.  That's where the not comes in.

Would you like me to outline the procedure?  I won't unless specifically asked as it is complicated.  Suffice to say that you are not racing to the S/F line but rather back to the point where you started where an elapsed time will be noted.  Easily done.  You want to carry on past that point to the S/F line to score a registered time?  Fine but it doesn't figure in the final positions.

[Bob Simpson]

Couldn't you just give me a hint?  It doesn't have to get complicated.  I'm guessing that you just use the replay analyzer to pick a time vs distance on the telemetry graph?  But that seems a real pain in the ass compared with the automatic data in GPLRA at the finish line.

I've done this track as a time trial in VOR and we just had people sit off the track in the pits or else off the track entirely until one person texted them to leave at one minute intervals.  That way you can either let people do 2 laps to try for a fast time or just restrict it to one flying lap.  Usually you let the faster guys go first.  But when I did it, I just left last after telling people when to leave.

Doing a race start means that people have to spend at least 3/4 hour doing a qualifying time.

[Border Reiver]

Running Targa as any sort of a conventional race is insanity.

A time trial makes sense since then you are not directly racing cars on the road. If someone catches someone else then you will have at least a 1 minute time difference and so the car which catches should simply be let passed, (which can also be a benefit for both drivers).

Like Bob I have run Targa with Atlas where we set a 2 hour qualifying session and someone was nominated as starter. That person effectively flagged people off from the pits at 1 minute intervals to start their lap(s). Starting from the pits, your out lap is still timed and to be honest can count fine if we are just running a single lap event. Alternatively, after their first lap players could continue and drive a second lap and either score the best lap out of the two as their time, or we could add up both laps and take the combined time to complete two laps. We need to decide this beforehand though since carrying fuel for one lap or two laps would probably make more of a difference than anyone worrying about starting from the pits on cold tyres. I know some leagues also ran the event as a time trial where shift-R penalties got added, but again I'd see no point in that since you end up back to your full fuel load and on cold tyres and stationary, so gain absolutely no advantage through having to use a shift-R.

Another point to note though with Targa is that I think you only get something like ten minutes after the session officially ends to finish your lap you have started, which clearly isn't enough here in some cases, so we can't be too ambitious about what is attempted within the two hour available time window of a qually session.

Good point also from Bob regarding running in race mode about having to spend something like an hour on qually to drive one lap to determine a grid for a race where the grid will be broadly speaking irrelevant, but then having to do at least one more lap for the race itself.

All I would say about starting order though is that it is slightly more interesting and also in some ways more sensible (and realistic to the actual event) to put the fast cars out last on track. I know that this means that they will catch and need to pass other cars, but, otherwise I don't see the point in doing any of this as an online event where we all meet up otherwise? If cars depart at one minute intervals, fastest cars first, then we will all just get further apart and logically then no one would ever see any other car, and so I'd wonder what the point is? We can all hotlap offline, set our best time and post it here and then compare who went fastest, but that isn't the spirit of how the real race worked, and faster cars did have to pass slower cars, but equally they shouldn't get blocked while doing so, after all there is a minute time gap if you see another car, so it is not them that you are directly racing, but possibly you are racing someone else around 1 minute away from you on the road so there is no point in getting into a dice with a car next to you on track, they are not your competition. The other aspect of the slowest guys going out later on is the one about the session possibly ending before they get around and finish their lap(s) since they start off last and will take longest to complete the lap(s). Equally, with the fast guys all going first, would they go out and drive their lap(s) and then just sit there to wait for everyone else to finish? Slower guys first, faster guys at the end should hopefully mean that everyone would finish up the event at around about the same time, and we would get to see the result there and then.

Just some thoughts....

Rob

(Oh, yes, I forgot to say, with my PC set up that any form of in car text message to signify a race start is entirely pointless since first up I use a three screen setup so it is way off outside my peripheral vision when driving and I also use the widescreen patch (obviously), so any such messages are invisible anyway. All they do is that they make my screen flicker annoyingly, so I tend to turn the chat off while driving. Messages while waiting in the pits to tell drivers to pit out and start their runs this is all fine though for me, just that once on track they become useless. Of course, we can also use Teamspeak to verbally flag drivers off to start?....)

Edited by Border Reiver, 08 December 2016 - 12:46 PM.

[Tom Johnson]

My selfish attempt to inspire myself to actually finish a lap at this track has turned out not to be more difficult than anticipated. I don't hot lap and running this track with the AI wouldn't do for me either, but to have other cars to chase is much more satisfying. I had originally thought of just skipping practice and starting the race, but that doesn't seem to be the best way for this track. Starting at one minute intervals from the pits works for me as long as we can get any late joiners to follow directions also. It would be very helpful if drivers would commit to the race ahead of the time in order to determine starting order. I will try to post more in the official announcement. Since this was my pick for the Big Race, I will stay back and be the starter, and begin my race once the last car has started.

[Border Reiver]

Equally, I'd also be happy to act as starter if you want Tom, and you can be the hare for me to chase?

It might be that 1 minute gaps are too much to ensure that we will occasionally see each other and 30 second gaps would be more interesting? Last time I ran in an event like this at Targa we had 1 minute gaps I think and IIRC I saw two other cars during my single lap.

I am happy to commit to turn up for the race, which if my maths is correct is at 21:00 GMT, (the current version of local time in the UK) on Saturday evening?

Rob

[Donnie Yourth]

Out with the Old!  In with the New!  It's 2017 and we have a new slate of race tracks opening the year.  In the zips to follow, revised grids for our candidates.  Files have been provided for all mods.

 2017 grnzland grids.zip   10.75K   6 downloads

 2017 enna grids.zip   12.87K   3 downloads

 2017 adelaide grids.zip   12.15K   3 downloads

 2017 jarama grids.zip   13.06K   3 downloads

And for the BR...

 2017 dayto24h grids.zip   11.35K   3 downloads

[Donnie Yourth]

Rolling right along...  It's February just over the horizon and Tom Johnson has selected some fine venues and mods for our pleasure.

Grids for the hosted events follow...

 adc stardust feb 2017.zip   3.1K   4 downloads

 adc bridgehampton feb 2017.zip   2.86K   6 downloads

 adc zolder67 feb 2017.zip   3.16K   3 downloads

 adc monza feb 2017.zip   2.92K   3 downloads

...and not to be forgetting the BR...Big Race...set for winged '69 cars at the Nurb...

 adc nurburgring BR feb 2017.zip   1.66K   2 downloads

Best of Luck, Chaps!  

[Donnie Yourth]

Thread closed...